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Cheadle and Gatley Lib Dems are moving
Cheadle and Gatley Lib Dems are moving
What were the local issues four decades ago?
Cheadle and Gatley Lib Dems are moving
Lib Dems press Virgin over Stockport Station ticket barriers
by Lib Dem team on 15 July, 2015
Virgin Trains, who manage Stockport Station, are having to install ticket barriers at each end of the tunnel connecting the Edgeley and Town Centre sides. It’s a diktat from government, keen that major stations across the country do everything they can to make sure people who use the trains buy a ticket.
Fair enough – can’t argue with that aim – but the tunnel at Stockport is also used by people to walk from one side to the other, and the alternative routes can be a lot longer. That includes football fans and children going for swimming lessons.
Virgin are building a new ticket office at the Edgeley side so people can come in from either side of the station.
The Lib Dems accept the need to get more people buying tickets for trains, but we want Virgin to find a way to allow non-rail-users to pass through. There are several solutions in use at other stations with similar problems (e.g. Derby, Sheffield) so it’s not a problem that can’t be solved.
One solution won’t work though. Stockport Labour councillors have suggested that the, because the underpass has been in public use for many years, a public right of way can be established which would prevent it being shut off in thi way. They are mistaken, unfortunately. The British Transport Commission Act of 1949 stops a right of way being established over railway land.
We are working with the Council to press Virgin Trains to find an alternative solution. They have to put the barriers in, but there should be a way to allow pedestrians to pass through.
If you agree and want to support the campaign, please write to the Station Manager, Stockport Station, Grand Central Way, Stockport, SK3 9HZ asking Virgin to find a way to allow pedestrians through.
Latest news on this story here.
28 Comments
Whist agreeing that something has to be done to prevent non fare payment they at the moment only have revenue collection staff at the bottom of steps for platforms 3&4 for platforms 0,1 & 2 you can walk off without payment being made. Even platforms 3 & 4 are not manned for the whole duration that the station is open.
Even at M/cr Piccadilly they don’t have revenue collection at the end of each platform and on numbers of occasions I’ve been able to walk through without showing my pass.
The easy method would be to place barriers on the access to platforms leaving underpass clear.
No doubt Virgin and Network Rail are correct in law but the way this scheme has been introduced without any consultation is high-handed in the extreme. Whether this route is a right of way or not, it has been used as such by large numbers of people every day for very many years.Presumably they wanted to get the barriers in quickly before anyone had time to raise objections. They obviously view the public of Stockport – many of whom are their customers – with complete disdain.
Initially I thought the underpass could be split again down the middle as it was until the 1980s, but since then of course lifts have been introduced to the platforms on the opposite side from the steps to the platforms, so this solution, as with the barriers at the foot of the steps, would not be acceptable.
Two things.
1. Build an alleyway so that people can still walk through without tickets.
2. If you wish to meet someone of a train to help with bags etc or to see someone off there should be a facility to allow this, years ago you bought a platform ticket.
Just back for Berlin – so refreshing to simply buy a ticket and travel on all forms of transport with no barriers anywhere…real freedom. Let’s not make the rest of the country like London with barriers everywhere, they are irritation and just slow you down. Why not trust people again, like in Berlin and other European cities? JB
Really the message to virgin should be either build a bridge over the railway at there expense as compensation or leave it open to the public.
The problem is that we can’t force them to do either of those – and it’s the government telling them to block it off. We’re working to persuade them to find an alternative.
The ‘solution’ at Sheffield is that there are still no barriers there because the Council refused planning permission!
The number of barriers being installed (3 + a manual gate at each end?) seems inadequate; and many users (TfGM Concession cards, Wayfarers, Virgin & Cross-Country print-at-home tickets, bus/train tickets issued on buses…) will have to be let through the manual gate.
It’s not easy to see how barriers could be fitted at Stockport’s platform entrances, as suggested above, as the lifts could be used to by-pass them unless barriers were put at the lifts as well. The only feasible solution might be a completely new footbridge with lifts as at Cheadle Hulme, retaining the tunnel as a public path only.
The barriers have barcode readers Charlie so Virgin & CrossCountry print at home tickets should be scanable to get through.
I welcome the barriers as the amount of people jumping on Virgin Trains knowing checks are rare and guards have finished checking tickets around Stoke/ Macclesfield is rife . It will also educate everyone in stockport to buy a ticket before boarding which is a huge annoyance and they will not be able to run for trains at the last minute without a ticket.
People will get extra exercise by walking further round so it will be better for the people of stockport’s health too
Sheffield City Council refused planning permission because the bridge over the station linking to Sheffield University Supertram stop was built in conjuction with and part funded by the council, so they couldn’t legitimately disallow the people of Sheffield access to it.
A solution could be that the wider gate on the right hand side (the lift side) could be used for through pedestrians, with a fence put up, and 1 or 2 members of staff in the vicinity of the lift to check tickets of anyone using/attempting to use the lift?
They already have 2 or 3 members of staff on pretty much permanent duty ticket-checking at the bottom of the Manchester/North bound platforms 3 &4, and sometimes at the bottom of the southbound platforms 1 and 2, and the article in the Stockport Express did boast of creating 7 extra jobs, so it’s not like having 1 or 2 staff members around the lift would be a drain on staffing resources.
Also of interest is how they intend to barrier/check tickets of passengers using Platform 0 – as there are three access points, the lift, direct from the car park, and up the stairs from the entrance hall. Putting the barrier/ticket check at the bottom of the stairs/bottom lift would create congestion, putting one barrier before the entrance/exit to the platform would a) have the potential for even more dangerous congestion of the stairs (departing passengers) or out on to the very narrow platform (arriving passengers) and b) potentially creating queues of very annoyed passengers getting wet in the rain, after trying to come in from the car park.
But I do think for the 5 “original” platforms, using the wider gate as a through pedestrian gate, with staff checking people/tickets at the lifts could be a solution?
I was traveling few the underground of Stockport railway station and found rail track employees putting up barrier systems to stop people entering unless they have a platform ticket. as this has been a right of way for over a 100 years do you consider this to be fair.
Hi Stuart – no we don’t think it’s fair. It isn’t a legal right of way, but it is a convenient passage people have long used to get between Edgeley and the town centre and we want that to continue.
Presumably as these barriers are in connection with the Virgin franchise they’re not too bothered about platform 0 as their trains rarely, if ever, use it. What does seem odd though is if you buy a ticket from the proposed booking office at the Edgeley end and your train leaves from platform 0, you will have to enter the station through one barrier and then exit it from the other end to get to platform 0 – so what happens to your ticket?
Is there actually going to be a booking office at the Edgeley end or just machines? At present only ticket machines have been installed so they’re going to have to build it pretty quickly to be open by August 18th.
The idea of the “customer hosts” hovering near the lifts so an open passageway can be left seems to be a good one.
As usual it seems a scheme has been rushed through without being thought through properly.
The solution is actually quiet simple. Place the ticket barriers at the bottom of the stairs from platforms 1/2 and 3/4 AND add two additional barriers around the two lifts, both of which are in alcoves. This would keep a wide central aisle for people cutting through and secure access to platforms to ticket holders.
I was there on Thursday night and they are already installing the stands for them. However there is a footbridge just up from the station that goes behind the armoury .. Perhaps the council could find a way of linking it through to the car park/ grand central area?
Yes – a great chance was missed (as so often) when the Infirmary was sold off for redevelopment. A shared pedestrian/cycle path between Thomson Street / Frances Street and the station area should have been a planning requirement.
You’re probably aware that nearly 3.1/2 thousand people have signed a petition against this, surely this should go towards working out some kind of amicable agreement?
Let’s hope so Dee – the more who sign, the better.
https://www.change.org/p/virgin-trains-free-access-through-stockport-station-underpass?recruiter=345830788&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink
Greater Manchester pensioners and others with concession cards will, I suppose, have to be allowed through the barriers – even to visit Starbucks or the toilet if so inclined – by showing their ‘bus pass’ (also valid on local trains) even if not actually catching a train.
Come on Lib Dems – Get off your knees and use your brains!
The subway was built as it is for a reason – I suggest you ask Network Rail – the inheritors of the Manchester and Birmingham Railway why?.
You may just find that the railway is under a legal obligation to build and maintain this facility in perpetuity – so – instead of pleading from a position of weakness you could have a thumping big stick with which to beat the railway owners and operators – except of course – that’s not a very liberal thing to do – well not in public anyway!
Come on – I dare you – try the intellectual and researched road – it may get you where you need to be.
Hi Frank – we’ve researched this and taken legal advice to find out what the “legal obligation” is exactly and that’s why we’re taking the approach that we are. Of course you’re right, if the legal situation were different then we would be approaching it differently.
How long do you think we should keep this petition going??
I always buy a ticket at the station. I’m usually approached more than one to show my ticket on the train too. I’m going to boycott all Virgin products until they resolve this issue. I intend to encourage others to do so. Putting the turnstiles at bottom of the stairs for platforms 1&2 and 3&4 would have been a solution to the problem that suits everyone. Instead, they’ve took the cheapest and most obstructive approach – Shameless and organised GREED!
Let’s not forget- virgin trains proposed barriers at Stockport station to the dft, so had virgin actually researched how the underpass is used, probably not, and has virgin trains explained why they proposed Stockport station, not yet. The current barriers are in exactly the wrong location especially when a busy train arrives, only two barriers to use. Already my experiences of the barriers have been poor- why not use the staff like years ago to check tickets on and near the platforms? It’s a huge inconvenience and virgin refuses to listen.
Are you sure about the The British Transport Commission Act of 1949? I think it’s clause 57 you are referring to “as from the passing of this act” by my limited knowledge I would say
1. This act only precludes the establishment of rights of way by prescription on the same level as the track.
2. It does not apply to situations where the conditions for presumed dedication were met before the act came into force (the station opened in 1843).
Hi Pete,
The legal advice we’ve received is that it does apply. However, even if it didn’t the underpass couldn’t be a public right of way as it gets locked at night.
The barriers represent a threat to life and safety in case of fire. Should a fire break out on the platforms on football match days, then the barriers would present a crush point. A panicked crowd of football supporters would not be able to quickly evacuate the station.
If we really are stuck with these barriers then it would be easy to provide free “pass through” tickets. Pedestrians could take a time stamped tick at one end of the underpass and feed it into the turnstiles where the ticket could be read. Essentially this would be a simple barcode allowing say 20 minutes from issue to entering and exiting the underpass.
My vlog about Stockport train station’s new ticket barriers from Virgin Trains – a public safety issue about to cause the next Kings Cross or Hillsborough tragedy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHLEus_ZgRM